How Should I Handle Off-Leash Dogs?

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Welcome to Off Leash and Unfiltered. Trigger warning. I'm Kati Peppe, delivering the truth in dog training.

Hey everybody, this is your host, Kati Peppe. Before we jump in, I just wanted to take a quick second and remind you to hit the subscribe button because that helps us so, so, so much. We appreciate every subscribe and follow, and we have so much valuable information we wanna share with you. So we don't want you to make. Hey guys, thanks for joining me for another episode of Off Leash and Unfiltered. You are probably going to notice here in a few minutes, um, that the quality is a little different of this recording. Uh, it might be a little noisy or broken up in some spots because I was trying something new, um, and trying to record <laugh> while I was driving <laugh> because as you've probably noticed, I'm having a hard time keeping up with the podcast right now with everything else that we have going on.

And this time of year too, we just take a lot of vacation time. Um, I'm blessed enough to know that I'm gonna like wake up tomorrow and my daughter's gonna be grown up, so we're not missing out on the chance to enjoy the really short Maine summer. Um, and just have a ton of fun. So we've been taking lots of vacations and then in between those vacations, of course I am a chock full of dogs. So, uh, it's just been a lot going on. And then, you know, you might remember Joyce left me back in the spring to go to Greece for a week, uh, which, uh, was amazing for her.

Um, sucked for me <laugh>, but now she's gone again for another week, um, because she's got some family stuff going on. So, uh, she, her daughter graduated college and and she's helping her move out of state.

And then, uh, she has some other family stuff going on too, some family emergency stuff. So, uh, I'm gonna be on my own here for seven or eight days, and lemme tell you, feel it, feel it <laugh>. So, um, we have, and we have four training dogs right now, which is more than I usually take on. Um, but it's just because we have a little bit of overlap. Cora will be going home this week, um, and then we'll be back to three, which is a little more normal. Um, but the reason we have that overlap is we kind of spontaneously accepted a dog, um, spur of the moment.

A husky who is actually, it's an interesting case. She lives in a high-rise in Philadelphia with her owner. Um, but they like to vacation up here in the summertime on the coast at the beach, and they just, they have to go back to Philly for some medical, some family medical stuff.

So, uh, he decided this would be a really good time to just get the training that he's really, really wanted for her, um, for a while. She's two years old. And it's funny 'cause he said the last <laugh>, the last trainer that he tried to book with wouldn't take her because she was a husky, which I just think is so funny, just ridiculous. Um, on that note, all the things you can't teach huskies to do, we're gonna teach. So stay tuned for that. If you don't follow our social media, uh, follow us on Facebook or Instagram.

Uh, we also put some stuff on YouTube, but we don't have as much on there. YouTube has a lot of our like, long-form videos. Um, but we try to post a lot on Facebook and Instagram, and everyone's trying to get me to move to TikTok too. And I might, but I just, I just don't like it <laugh>.

It's just an awful place and it kind of gives me the ugh, but maybe, we'll see. I can't even keep up with all this. I don't need to think about do <laugh> doing more right now, I guess, right? We get this under control, but you guys, if I can record while I drive, I'm gonna get so much more efficient. 'Cause listen, I have a 35-minute drive from home to the training center and then of course back home. Um, so if I could chat you guys' ears off, like while I'm driving, I'm gonna get so much more efficient.

04:00 — Kati apologizes for rough audio while trying a recording approach that lets her get…

I'm gonna be able to get so much more done during my day, and I think I'm gonna be able to make it work. But this is the first time I did it, so if the audio's a little bit rough, um, I apologize. I tried to clean it up as much as I could, and I don't think it's too bad.

Uh, and I'm, I'm pretty sure though, I'm pretty confident I'm gonna get this perfected so that I can, I can do this and hopefully then you guys will hear from me twice a weekend <laugh> if I can get this working. So, um, thanks for joining me today. We have a good one for you today. We're gonna talk about off-leash dogs because I gotta tell you, it's not, it's actually probably one of my least favorite things to talk about, but it is the thing everybody else wants to talk about. And that's what I'm here for is you guys, right?

So every time we have a group class or, you know, I ask anybody like what they need help with or what their questions are, what they wanna look at, a high percentage of the time I get off-leash dogs, off-leash dogs. What do we do when we see an off-leash dog?

What do you do when you see an off-leash dog? What do we do about off-leash dogs? So let's talk about it, even though I don't like to talk about it <laugh>, but I agree, I'm totally with you. I feel your frustration. It's a thorn in my side too. And the thing you gotta remember is you're never gonna be able to control other people or their off-leash dogs, even if they're breaking the law. 'Cause it just, it shouldn't even be called a law because it's not enforced, which frankly burns my ass. But the fact is it's not enforced.

It probably never will be. And you're never going to be able to control or train other people. So let's talk about the things you can do to have a better off-leash experience. And lemme tell you why it's not my favorite thing, because I agree, like, guys, it's a thorn in side too, and it's why I limit myself and where I go to training doctor, they don't, it's a huge, huge issue. I feel your frustration. I totally agree. Um, and I wish I had an easy answer for you. But the fact is, and the reason I don't love talking about this topic is because there is really nothing you can do about it, right?

All you can control is you, just like in all your human relationships too, it's the same thing, right? You cannot control somebody else. You just can't.

And so I don't have any magic advice for you in that respect, but I can tell you what I do and I can give you advice and I can give you some tips and some strategies, um, and then that's all we can really do. So, so first and foremost, I think if you acknowledge and understand that all you can control is you, right, and your dog correctly, right? That you can't control anybody else, then that means that the number one most important thing you could do is train your dog, train your dog to be highly reliable.

So do all the things that we show you to do and that we talk about doing. Teach your dog to listen to you no matter what's happening, guys, that doesn't just mean teaching your dog how to come back when called or that they'll get a reward when they come back when called.

08:00 — Kati argues that reliable recall requires dogs to listen despite distractions, using consequences for…

What it means is teaching your dog, they have to listen to you no matter what the distraction is. And if they don't, there's a downside for that, a real downside that they wanna avoid, right? If your dog believes that, they'll come back even when they don't wanna, even when they're excited, even when they're in drive, even when they're nervous, uncomfortable about something, they'll come back, right? So that is hands down the number one thing that you could do. Um, if your dog is already e-collar trained, okay, this isn't the first thing to go out and do, introduce the dog to, uh, but if your dog is e-collar trained, we just talking about, I said our last group class, you should absolutely pair a very high correction with your recall.

And I don't mean correct the dog for not coming back. This has nothing to do with whether your dog comes back or not. It's very confusing to people because it's, we tend to have a very two-dimensional view of dog training, right? You reward the things you like and you punish or correct the things you don't like. And it's like, sure, but there's more to it than that, right? So that's a very simple approach to dog training.

Dogs are a little more complex than that. Behavior's a little more complex than that. Uh, so what we encourage people to do is to go out in their yard and let their dog sniff around where things are kind of calm and quiet, and then call your dog. You know, whether it be verbal or if you've taught your dog a beep on their collar, that's fine too. Doesn't matter. Whatever you would normally use, although I absolutely like you to pair this with your verbal recall no matter what, uh, because your collar malfunctioned, died or something, right?

And so then you would be helpless. I'd really like to make sure that your dog has, um, this association with your voice. So if you are gonna do it with the beeps, that's fine, but also do it with your verbal. And what you're gonna do is just call your dog and then no matter what the dog does, you're not even gonna wait to see, right?

You're just gonna wait one second, two seconds, something like that. And no matter what your dog is doing, you're gonna pair a very high correction with that call. And when I say very high, I mean whatever level makes your dog kind of knock their socks off, and you're gonna do it for a few seconds, okay? So for some dogs that might be very high on the dial, it might be 8,200. For other dogs that are extremely sensitive, maybe it's like 30 or 40, right? But it's not gonna be low, it's not gonna be middle of the road, it's not gonna be motivational. It needs to be high.

Now, the reason we do that is not to be mean, okay? It's because what that does is it's, you don't gravity to your recall. And what will happen in the future when your dog does see the squirrel, does see the dog, the rabbit, bike, whatever it is, and you call them, they're gonna remember that gravity. And that's extremely valuable because when your dog sees a distraction like that, the brain and the receptors all become dampened, meaning they don't feel things the same way anymore, right? So now if you were trying to break through those distractions with your e-collar, you're going to have a much more difficult time and your dog's not gonna internalize it the same way either for future episodes, okay?

However, so the brain will not receive a physical discomfort the same way when they're in that state. But it does remember memories the same way.

That doesn't change. And so you're silly if you don't take advantage of that science. Yeah, I'm gonna go ahead to say science, right? Because everyone will tell you that trainers like me are against science. It's like, no, like what we do is actually real science, right? It, it explains reality <laugh> accurately. Um, you need to install that memory in your dog. And you can't do it when your dog is already off the rails. You have to do it when things are calm. And that is hands down, biggest mistakes people make is they wait until the dog is fussing the bite or the rabbit, um, or whatever.

13:00 — Kati warns that dogs may ignore corrections, become frightened, or run away during highly…

And then, then they do it. And I'm not saying you shouldn't during that situation and your dog's not listening, obviously you have to, um, but there's a chance your dog will blow through it. Um, there's a chance they'll just scream and blow through it. There's a chance they'll get freaked out and run for the hills. Um, there's a chance that maybe it'll work, but they don't really internalize it, so you're gonna have to do it again next time, right? It doesn't really make the dog any safer. This protocol makes your dog safer. And it's not something you have to do all the time, guys.

It's something we tell people to do once or twice.

Basically, once you do it, you should see a difference in how your dog recalls. If you don't, then maybe you should try doing it again. Um, but we don't do it over and over and over again, right? If you don't see a difference, maybe you weren't high enough or maybe the dog doesn't believe that it's related, like especially if history, and then that's it. You do it once or twice and that, that's it, right? And then six months, a year down the road, whatever, if you feel like your dog's getting loosey-goosey again and, and they're not really reliably coming back or they're making you repeat yourself, that sort of thing, do it again.

Because guys, that is the most dangerous scenario. If you have to repeat yourself, if you have to struggle, if you have to tap that remote five times, look for the level, that's just a, a recipe for disaster.

Like, it's not a matter of if something's gonna go wrong, it's when, because you do not have control of your dog. Like, that's the bottom line. You think you do, you don't. What's really happening is you have a tool that will sometimes allow you to break through distractions and gain your dog's attention. But it's still a battle in the moment, right? And so you may very well eat, right, if you don't do it just right. If you're not fast enough, you're not high enough. If your dog's arousal is escalating faster than you are, you're gonna lose.

And it's so stupid because this just a thing you can cure with one simple little protocol that takes just a minute. Just let your dog go, sniff around, call them, provide a very high correction for a few seconds, few seconds. And then by the way, when your dog does come back to you, have a party, your Disney girl, right? Lots of love, lots of affection because it's a very high correction. It should scare your dog. Your dog should jump out of their skin a little bit, right? Guys, it's like three seconds of your dog's life. Hey, it's gonna come, it's gonna go, it's gonna be over with.

And then you get to shower them with love and affection or whatever it is they love, uh, play with them, I don't care, right? But it's a memory you wanna have stuck in their brain so that tomorrow, next week, four months from now, whatever, you find yourself in a situation, you call your dog and just spin around on a dime and they come back. And lemme tell you, not very many people can do that. Not very many people have a dog that will do that. And I see dogs with e-collar on and they don't do that.

It's funny because people insist on struggling, but they really do. They wanna struggle. I don't wanna struggle. I want safe, reliable dogs. And if I don't have that, they're not going off. Uh, but that's the number one thing you could do. And also one more side note about that protocol, you gonna do that again, it's for dogs that are already e-collar trained. And the first, first time you do that, guys, please put your dog on a long line. Especially if you're not in a fenced-in area, especially if you're not the type to really ever correct your dog, right?

18:00 — Kati identifies training without a leash before dogs understand the e-collar as a common…

Because they're gonna go, what the hell? And you don't want your dog to bump the hill to another one of the most common mistakes people make when they're doing DIY e-collar training. Can absolutely do it, right? But people make the mistake not having that leash on.

And until your dog is familiar with all of this and knows what to do, they might just run away. And what are you gonna do about it? Nothing. So even dogs that are e-collar trained, it's the first time you've done this protocol, it doesn't hurt to just put them on the long line, guys, and hang onto it. And even if you're in your yard and it is fenced in, we still like the long line because after you provide the high correction, we want to make, the very next thing that happens is your dog comes to you and they probably will anyway.

But if they don't, you've got a leash. So you can get them to come to you and then shower them with raise affection because I know about you, but I wanna know that if I do give my dog a good correction, but they're off leash, I wanna know that they're gonna do the right thing without correction, that they're gonna come back. It's so important so far and away, hands down, that is the biggest thing you can do to protect yourself against off leash dogs. Um, but let's talk about some of the other things that you can also do that we suggest.

So one of the other really valuable things you can do is not just teach your dog that they absolutely unequivocally have to come back to and to call them, but in addition to that, teach your dog not to run up to other dogs. Alright? So that would entail you go into places where there are other people and other dogs around. And if you don't have full trust and confidence in your dog right now, put them on the long line for this exercise, right? And you shouldn't be yanking your dog around by the long line, but you're just gonna hang onto it.

So if your dog makes a bad choice, they can't actually get away and charge up to other people's dogs. You're gonna go to one of these places. And when your dog fixates on a person or a dog or whatever the thing is really that you don't want them running up to, you're just gonna say no and tap the collar at a motivating level. Okay? So this is your, your way of telling your dog, we don't fixate on other people, other dogs, bikes, your, whatever it is, right?

That way your dog can't do what we call continue to get excited. If your dog is looking at something and they, it transitions into staring at something, what's happening is they're getting more and more stimulated and excited until they finally cross that threshold and can't stand it anymore. And then they're going to charge up to ine. So the idea is you cut the fuse short, right? They can't do the loading. They, because if they're not staring, they can't load. So don't let your dog stare at things so you don't want them charging up to. The second your dog sees another dog coming and they start staring and those ears come up.

21:00 — Kati describes interrupting fixation with an e-collar correction when a dog's tail rises or…

Maybe the tail comes up. That's the precise moment that you wanna say no, tap your e-collar at a level that's high enough that dissuades them. It's not a good idea to stare at those things, and be prepared to do it again, especially if you're walking toward the thing.

Because as you walk toward, it's gonna get more difficult for your dog and the arousal's going to escalate faster, which means your level will also probably need two be higher, right? So if you are a hundred feet away and you used, I don't know, a 19 throwing a number out there, who knows what it would be? It'd be different for every dog. But let's say you tapped at a 19 and it was just enough, okay, well as you continue to get closer, now you're 70 feet away. If your dog looks again, 19 might cut it, but I don't wanna find out, so I'm gonna turn it up to more like 25, 30, right?

So it's important to me that I can keep my dog from going back and they're gonna try to go back. That's just how the brain works, right? Not forever, not every time, not over and over again. But if you think you're just gonna tap once and that's gonna be the end of it, you are sorely mistaken, right? So teach your dog not to load on things. Now if your dog starts moving towards the thing, that's definitely a no and a correction, right? And then you've got your long line there just in case they need a little guidance after that correction.

But that will really, again, keep your dog, uh, more tuned into you than triggers. And when you do this too, it builds kind of, um, I mean it's like my Wi-Fi that I talk about, right? It sort of, it's, it becomes your leash without a leash. So when your dog starts to move towards something you don't want it to, starts to load on something you don't want it to, and you, you tap that button, it becomes just like pulling a leash. Except you don't need a leash, which is why it's so beautiful, right? And so you really do gain physical control of your dog, but you do it by controlling brain instead of actual physical, uh, which is amazing and so practical and so efficient.

24:00 — Kati recommends preventing fixation on dogs, people, and bikes, then choosing walking locations selectively.

But that's the second thing I would say is make sure your dog knows. You can not allow fixating on, loading on, or running up to other people, dogs, bikes, et cetera, uh, when you're out places. Third, be selective about where you go. So I don't go on wooded trails with dogs anymore, it just isn't worth it. So I could continue to go on wooded, wooded trails with dogs and bitch and moan about off-leash dogs, but I'm not going to because I know that's not gonna change.

I can't control other people. I will never be able to stop assholes from taking their crazy dogs on off-leash adventures on the trails. Untrained dogs, sometimes aggressive dogs or just crazy rude, overstimulated dogs or even just happy-go-lucky friendly dogs, right? But the thing is, you don't know, they're all mixed together. You don't know what you're gonna get. I will never be able to stop those people from going out on the trails. And so I just don't go, I don't go there. It doesn't mean I can't go out and have fun off the leash with my dog, but we don't go there.

And the reason I specify there is because wooded trails, it's too easy for people to surprise you guys because you can't see that far ahead. Most of the time it's either way uphill or way downhill or around a curve, right? It's heavily wooded. So your visibility is very limited. Anybody could come around the next corner at any time with any kind of dog, and there's just not anything you can do about it. And I don't have any magic to deal with that <laugh>.

Uh, I'm not saying you can't do it, right? But you have to accept the risks that come with that. And I'm not saying it's right, I'm just saying it's out of your control. So we stick to places like parks that are open, right? Open grassy areas, field parks, uh, beaches are fine. Um, a lot of times, you know, you can find certain beaches, certain times of day that aren't super crazy mobbed too, but it's wide open and I can see who's there and who's coming and is far and away my preference. Number four, have a protocol in your head for what you do when someone else's dog is coming at you.

So if you don't already have this plan established in your head, you are going to struggle. You're going to find yourself in situations where you're panicked and you don't know what to do. But that can't happen if you already have a plan. So you need to already have your boundaries established: what's okay, what's not okay? And what do I do when it's not okay? And here's, you don't have to do this, but this is what I do or what I would do, right? So if I'm out with my dog and we're off leash and I see someone else with an off-leash dog, first of all, I'm assessing them and what their dog is like and how under control they are or, or not or likely.

27:00 — When another dog appears, Kati creates distance, changes areas, or returns to her car…

And I will intentionally give them space. If I have time, I might walk away, I might just go to a different area. We might go back to our car, depends on the situation, right? But I will move away. Um, I will call my dog and we will just go, you know, stand off to the side, sit on a bench, sit in the grass, what, whatever it's, right, depends on where you are and what you're doing. Um, but far and away my first line of defense would be to just call my dog. And we're gonna be away from people, especially if I don't like the looks of their dog.

Um, if their dog sees us and is beelining for us, that is when you go into emergency mode, right? Now, I don't actually like making people panic about this scenario. Um, yes, it's bad. No, I don't like it. Yes, I make a big deal out of it, but I don't want you walking around in terror either, right? It's like most dogs are not going to attack your dog and cause an injury, um, or kill them or anything dramatic like that. But they might, they might, right? Or vice versa, right? If your dog's not super friendly, then I guess, you know, in that situation, right?

So it's different. Um, there's no way to know the dog's intent. So people like to try to judge by the dog's body language and whatnot. And sure, you can do a little bit of that, but there's really just no way to know because an overexcited, overstimulated dog who's charging at you can look a lot like just a friendly dog that wants to just come trample all over your dog and use them like a treadmill.

Like as a toy, right? Wants to play, can look a lot like a dog that wants to come rip your dog's throat out. Like they can look the same <laugh>, especially to someone who's not super experienced. Um, but I can tell you right now, the tail wagging doesn't mean anything. And that's the number one thing we hear when people's, when their own dogs do something to another dog or another person, um, as well as "tail was wagging," doesn't mean anything, guys. All that means is arousal. It's just arousal. So the tail carriage, how high or low it is, how fast it's wagging, those things can be indicators, okay?

30:00 — When a dog charges, Kati's first priority is calling her own dog back to…

Let me just be clear. You're not gonna stand there while a dog's charging at you and assess all of that <laugh>.

So, um, the, the rule of thumb for me is dogs are charging at us. Um, I obviously wanna call my dog if I haven't and I want my dog with me so I can, you know, try to keep this other dog away. And I will, if I have time, I will tell the owner, ask the owner to call their dog, right? And I'll be nice about it once: can you call your dog, please? And then if they don't or they can't or they're rude, now it is my job to just protect my dog's space so that nothing bad can happen.

And so that may very well mean kicking that person's dog for running into your dog's space. And you need to be prepared to do that.

It's not something I wanna do, but before I go out into any of these places out in the world, I already have it established in my head that I absolutely, positively will. Because the one rule that I will never deviate from is it is always, always, always my job, my job to keep off-leash dogs away from my dog, always. Unless, like I said, that like if it's a dog you've assessed that you're fine with your dog going and saying hi to. I never do that personally, right? If it's a dog I don't know. If it's a dog I know, then maybe fine.

But, um, I never want my dog meeting.

And so have in of, I'm gonna do whatever it takes to keep your dog away from mine and it'll be physical, right? Because what else are you gonna do? You don't have any magic. So if you like to frequent these spaces with your off-leash dog, um, and take your dog out for these off-leash adventures, I highly, highly recommend that you carry, um, something with you just in case. They do make mace specifically for dogs. Um, you could even carry a squirt bottle with like vinegar. It is better than nothing. Um, a <laugh> a stick, frankly, is better than nothing.

33:00 — Kati recommends carrying a slip lead as an emergency tool for a worst-case dog…

Although it won't do a lot if you actually encounter an aggressive dog.

Um, and if nothing else, at least put a slip lead in your pocket because a slip lead is what you would need if the worst-case scenario, and hopefully this never happens, right? And most of the time this isn't gonna happen, guys. But let's just say you did encounter a very aggressive dog who latched onto your dog. Let's just say it happened. The way you rectify that situation is you put a slip lead around the offending dog's neck and you pull straight up. Now, if they're latched onto your dog, no, you won't be able to take the loop from the slip lead and slip it over the dog's head.

That's okay. You just wrap it around the neck and you can thread the handle through the loop of the leash, right?

Uh, and you pull straight up. Dog's paws will be off the ground, at least the front ones, and you do that until they let go because they can't breathe. That is how you break up a real and true aggressive attack. And so if you carry nothing else with you, at least have that. Um, but yeah, I will absolutely stand in front of my dog, kick a dog to keep them away from my dog. And no, I don't like doing that, but I can't feel bad about it because it's not my fault. They chose not to train their dog, or they chose not to have any regard for other people and their space. They chose that for themselves.

So there's a common saying that boundaries don't require the other person to do anything. And that couldn't be more true in this case, right? I'm not asking them for, for anything. All I'm saying is don't charge into my space, don't charge into my dog's space. All I'm saying is leave me and my dog alone. That doesn't require them to do anything special or fancy. They don't have to do me any favors. They just need to leave us alone. And so I have no problem enforcing my boundaries. So it'll be a much easier if you aren't trying to make a judgment call in being situational, you already have established in your head, right?

And the size of the dog might play a role too. If you have a big dog and it's a tiny dog running at you, well, maybe you do let the dog sort it out. I wouldn't, I, you know, it wouldn't be my preference. Um, but obviously if your dog does harm to the other dog, again, that's super unfortunate. It's not something I would ever want to happen. But they chose that fate for their own dog. That is not your fault.

37:00 — Kati recommends deciding how to respond before an encounter rather than improvising under pressure.

Um, but so having that already established in your head is super, super helpful because, guys, avoiding thinking about these things until they happen and then just trying to figure it out in the moment, and it all happens so fast, it's a real, that's a real bad plan. <laugh>, that's a real bad plan. So there's no way for you to know exactly what's going to happen, right? But it's like if you have at least a few principles in your head and you say, I absolutely unequivocally am not okay with this and will do this, and then you just snap right into execution when you find yourself in that situation.

And to me, that's very, very helpful.

And you know, for most dogs too, um, you won't even have to kick them, right? I gotta say most dogs, if you posture and you get out in front of your dog and you kind of stamp your feet and you puff yourself up, you know, like most animals would when they're on the defensive, uh, especially if you, you make a noise and like, ha, get outta here. You know, that sort of thing. And you sort of wave your hands at them and you're very, you're stiff and you're puffed up and you know that sort of posturing.

Most dogs are gonna go, oh, we're not welcome over here. Like, they're gonna take note of that. Um, that's going to make them a little nervous and they're gonna probably leave. A dog that doesn't probably needs to be kicked. Okay? A dog who bypasses that to get to your dog is a dog that is much more high risk, right? Because they're disregarding all those warnings from you. That's a huge red flag in and of itself. So I would say be prepared to just get in front of your dog and posture and drive that other dog away.

And at that point, you've done everything you can, right? If, if that dog is still trying to get to your dog, you need to punt it into next week.

Um, because you know, at that point too, that that dog is probably bad news because that really isn't normal. Um, I wouldn't feel great about that <laugh>. So, um, but I will usually just step in front of my dog and kind of posture like that. And that works for most dogs. And if it doesn't, like I said, then uh, I have no qualms about getting physical to keep that dog away from mine, especially at that point. Alright, guys, thanks for joining me. Um, enjoy your off-leash adventures. Be safe. Keep your dog safe, and for God's sakes, train your dog.

40:00 — Kati closes by emphasizing obedience and inviting listeners to send future episode ideas through…

That's the most important thing. Teach your dog to listen to you, of course. Follow our social media, send us your ideas, let us know what you wanna talk about and we'll see you next time. Hey guys, thanks for joining us today. I really hope you enjoyed the show. If there's a specific topic you'd like to hear discussed, you can send that to me directly via email or fan mail. Just jump down into the show notes. That information will be there for you. I really look forward to hearing from you. Thanks for supporting the show. And I.