Correction: The Key to Lasting Behavior Change

00:00 — Kati Peppe introduces Diamond Canine Dog Training and its focus on e-collar training, off-leash…

Welcome to Off Leash and Unfiltered Trigger Warning. I'm Kati Peppe, delivering the Truth in Dog Training.

Hey everybody. Welcome back to another episode of Off Leash and Unfiltered. I'm Kati Peppe, owner of Diamond Canine Dog Training in Biddeford, Maine. We specialize in eco training, so we do off leash obedience, behavior modification, so helping people stop, uh, behaviors that they don't like, like jumping and barking and resource guarding, and even separation anxiety and aggression issues, reactivity, that sort of stuff. Uh, we also do puppy training, so that's who we are and what we do. And this podcast is our way of sharing, uh, what we do with you at home. So we tend to, sorry, I hear some kind of ruckus out there, <laugh>.

The dogs are getting restless. Um, I tend to pick topic that I am talking about with my clients every day that are bringing their dogs here for training, whether it's private sessions or board and training, um, things I'm talking about in my consultations on the phone. So this is stuff that I know if other people are, uh, needing, uh, then it's probably stuff that everybody could use. That's what we're talking about. So what are the things that your dog does that drive you nuts? <laugh>, because almost everybody has got something.

Um, I hear a lot of, she's a good dog 95% of the time, <laugh>, right? It's that pesky 5%. Um, and that matters. So your dog's never gonna be perfect. Of course, they're not gonna be a robot. We don't want them to be a robot anyway. Um, but we don't want them to drive you nuts either. It's not good for your relationship, uh, and ultimately it's not good for them. So we want you to try and, and clean that 5% up if that's your situation. Um, or maybe your dog just drives you nuts all the time.

And I mean, that's even worse. So when that happens, you just, just start, you just don't like your dog. Like it gets in the way of bonding. I was just talking about that with someone the other day, and that was my situation when I had, uh, a puppy who was really, really struggling with some serious behavioral issues.

Um, I was talking to a customer the other day that had a dog, still has the dog. The dog will be here for boarding next month. Um, but when she first got him, he just had so many issues. Um, she just didn't, didn't like him, didn't wanna be around him, didn't look forward to like, spending time with him, right? And that's not why we get a dog, and it's no fault of hers. So of course she's afraid to tell people that because, uh, she feels like, you know, that makes her sound mean or callous, but it, it doesn't, nobody gets a dog to like be driven out of their mind and be frustrated and all these things.

Um, so it sounds like they've made some progress since then. So they're, they're in a little bit of a better place and we're gonna make it even better.

04:00 — She argues owners should directly stop behaviors that repeatedly drive them crazy instead of…

So that's exciting. But anyway, you don't wanna let your dog do things that drives you nuts. And so how do you stop those things? Well, if you've been listening to me for any amount of time, then you probably already know what's gonna come out of my mouth, which is punishment. So I wanna talk more about that today because it comes up so frequently. 'cause it's such a big, big, big, big, big part of, of what I'm talking about on this podcast all the time. Um, and I mean, it's a, it's a big part of what we do.

'cause even though it comprises such a small percentage of our time, uh, when we're training, it's probably the biggest game changer and the most valuable piece of information that we ever share. It's always the thing that's missing when we meet people and their dogs. Um, it's this one simple little thing that just makes a massive difference.

Um, without this, you cannot achieve reliability and you cannot inhibit behaviors. And so that means if your dog has things that drive you nuts, they always will if you don't have this information. And so I wanted to take an opportunity today to kind of delve into that a little bit deeper and kind of talk about the finer details of punishment. Um, which is such a taboo topic nowadays. Uh, it sounds so harsh, doesn't it? Um, but punishment from a behavioral perspective, um, all that means is it is something that decreases or eliminates a behavior. That's it, that's all it means.

So it doesn't mean it's harsh. It doesn't mean it hurts, although it can. Um, it doesn't mean it causes any harm. It shouldn't. Um, I'll give you an example. I actually had a dog. This dog was a frequent flyer here. He was here all the time, and I miss him. He's passed away since. Um, and his name was Louis <laugh>. And, uh, he was doing this weird behavior riding in the car with me, um, with the air that was coming through the vent. So anyways, every time he would move toward the air vent and I didn't care.

He wasn't doing anything that was like disruptive or like anxious. Um, I think they were just getting his attention 'cause there was, there was air coming through them. Uh, I don't know. But at any rate, I would, it would, for some reason it would trigger me to like pet him and I would pet him on the head, which he didn't like <laugh>, he didn't like it. And I suppose I knew that. Um, but I just wasn't thinking about it in the moment. Again, it was just sort of an autopilot response for me while I was driving.

I noticed it afterwards, but I, I would pet him on the head every time he did this. And it, he only, you know, I think not at first. So he did, he did it a few times and then I pet him and he did it again and I pet him and then he stopped doing it.

So w why? Well, because it isn't like getting pet on the head <laugh>, right? So I literally punished that behavior by petting him, right? So when people think of punishment, they certainly don't think of sharing a affection as a punishment, but it can be. So it can be anything that the dog doesn't like can act as a punishment. Now, you can also do things that the dog doesn't like and it's not a punishment, right? So it's absolutely, this is gonna sound ridiculous, but it's absolutely positively possible that in that same scenario, I could have shocked him on an eco and he still would've done the behavior, right?

08:00 — She explains that an unpleasant stimulus only functions as punishment when it actually reduces…

Especially if it was a lower level stimulation.

Um, so literally in that situation, it is possible that a mild to moderate eco correction would not have been a punisher while petting him on the head actually was a punisher. So you have to get out of that frame of mind where punishment is a certain way, it's a certain thing, it's a certain intensity, it's a certain discomfort level, and you have to, well, I suppose that it is, but it's not always physical. You have to get into the frame of mind. That punishment means nothing than nothing more than decreasing a behavior. And what does that is entirely up to the dog.

So there's a million different ways you can punish a behavior. Guys, some are more practical than others, okay? But if it's not effective, if it doesn't work, then it's not a punishment. If it does decrease the behavior, then it's a punishment even if you don't feel like it should be. So I just shared an example of how affection was actually a punishment, um, and decreased the behavior. Um, and you know, that's a really easy example because there are lots of dogs that don't like affection or don't like it on the head region. Um, if you have a nervous dog who's afraid of touch or just afraid of you, and every time they do a behavior you approach and touch them, they're probably gonna stop doing that behavior.

So you gotta step out of your traditional conventional idea of what you think punishment means first off.

And then the second thing, and, and the most important thing I think that I wanna convey is, so how do you do it effectively and efficiently? And I wanna really delve into those finer details today. Um, because all too often we're just skimming over it and saying, do this, do that. Um, just say no entire correction to it. So I wanna tell you exactly what that looks like and feel free to tune into our social media on Instagram, Facebook, YouTube, um, where we talk a lot about this and we show it, uh, often as well so you can actually see what the process looks like.

Um, and I have a really great example, <laugh> from yesterday that I'll share in just a little bit. Um, but so here's the deal, guys. If your dog has a behavior and you want that behavior to go away, there is only one way to truly achieve that.

And that is to tie an intolerable consequence to that behavior. Now notice I didn't say negative consequence because it is negative, right? It's, it's gotta be something the dog doesn't like, but just being something the dog doesn't like isn't enough. It has to be intolerable, okay? And I don't say that because I'm a big meanie, although that's what people would love for you to believe. I say that because, well, 'cause I know what I'm talking about. So one of the biggest things we see is people nagging their dog. And I think we've gotten to a point where everybody actually really thinks that that's where you're supposed to land.

12:00 — She criticizes repetitive nagging and says effective corrections should eliminate unwanted behaviors rather than…

That's where you're supposed to end up, is you're supposed to end up in a situation where you can stop the dog from doing the behavior, but they go back and do it again in 10 minutes.

And people think that's normal and that's good, and that they've achieved success and they haven't. That's a fail. So the idea behind a proper punisher is that it actually gets rid of the behavior. It doesn't mean your dog will be perfect forever, but the behavior is more or less gone, right? And you might need an occasional touchup here and there, um, because behavior is, behavior is behavior, right? And sometimes things regenerate or they pop up here or there, uh, the dog decides to push a boundary again at some point. But if they're deciding to do it again and again and again, you know, every 10 minutes or every two hours or every other day, then you're just not doing it right?

You're not providing, you're either not providing a consequence that's truly intolerable or the dog doesn't understand that it's that behavior that's causing the consequence. And so I wanna talk about what that process looks like so that you know exactly what to do. Alright?

So I'm gonna start with an example, but the truth is guys, unwanted behavior pretty much across the board and we'll get into what some of the more difficult ones can be too. But, um, pretty much across the board this is gonna be true. So you can generalize, it's okay. But one classic example of an unwanted behavior, right? Is dogs that jump. How many of us have dogs that jump all over us or all over our guests? So let's start there with something really, really simple and basic. The moment your dog begins the process of jumping up, and this might be before they even get to the person, okay?

Now, it doesn't have to be if your dog is in the act of doing the jumping, that is an appropriate time. But also, if your dog is about to be in the act of jumping, like they have started the process on their way to the jumping, that is a fine time as well. Okay? So as, as the behavior is occurring or is about to occur, you can already see the wheels turning in the dog's head. That is the moment guys, when you must say no, pick any word you want, honestly, but no makes the most sense.

It's usually the easiest to remember. It's nice and simple. It's short and concise. It's, it's the word that we use.

If you have multiple dogs in your house, you might opt to use something else instead, you might use a color or a number or just some other random word if that's what you want. The reason being, you want each dog to know when that no is meant for them, right? And so if you're just using one word, you might be talking to one dog and the other dog gets all freaked out. 'cause they don't know, they think it's directed at them, right? So if you give them each their own word, you don't have to worry about that.

16:00 — She instructs owners to say “no” before delivering the correction, rather than speaking during…

So just something to think about. Um, but you'll say no. The moment your dog begins engaging in this unwanted behavior after you say no. Now that's important. Not before, not during, not simultaneously to saying no. After you are done saying no, then you should deliver a correction.

Now people are wicked bad at that, wicked bad. We have it in our heads that we have to do it immediately right now, right now, right now, right now, 10 seconds ago, and we rush and we do it while we're saying no. Or we do it so soon after we say no, that the dog, the no doesn't land on their ears. They don't even have a second to process it. So I encourage you, especially the first few times to count at least to two before you begin to move to deliver a correction. So you'll say no.

One, two, go give your correction, whatever it's gonna be. And we're gonna talk about that too, okay? After you say no, you have to deliver whatever your correction of choice is. Now far and away my preference is an e-collar because it's super easy, it's extremely practical, effective, efficient, and harm-free.

Okay? It works at a distance across the house, across the yard. You can adjust the intensity with the spin of a dial. You can tap them on the shoulder or you can light them up like the 4th of July, right? So depending on your dog and your scenario and what behavior you're dealing with and how aroused they are, uh, it's just so easy, far and away the most practical way for the average dog owner to be able to correct unwanted behaviors. So someone comes through the door, your dog starts to beeline over there and you know they're gonna jump because historically that's what they do.

They jump right? So your dog's bee lining over there, they're about to leap into the air and jump up and do whatever it is they do.

You are going to yell no. And then you're going to grab your e-collar remote, you're gonna take a second. You're gonna spin your dial so it goes up high and you're gonna depress the button for at least a full second, right? Because if you just do those quick baby taps, 'cause people are weenies, the dog hardly notices it. It's like in one ear out the other, bam, bam. They don't even know what happened. They don't even hardly notice it. So if you're gonna deliver a correction for god's sakes, deliver a correction, okay? So you can hold the button down for up to 10 seconds.

Um, but, and you don't have to do that. There are cases where we do, I mean, you just, you have a lot of flexibility with these things, which is why I love them. But at least hold the button down for a second. Make sure your dog notices the correction for god's sake <laugh>. Okay? And that's it. Now, if your dog does it again, then repeat the same exact process again except probably bump your level up.

Certainly if you have to do it a third time, you need to bump your level up and you don't wanna bump it up by one point or two points. You wanna make a leap, right? Because otherwise you become like the frog in the boiling water where you're just inching upward, inching upward, inching upward, and you're just desensitizing your dog to it. So you need to make a leap that's noticeable. You need to make an impact. Now, if you do this right, you're not gonna have to do it more than a few times guys. So it might take a few different people or a few different scenarios for your dog to start to really generalize this and go, oh, it doesn't matter who comes through the door.

20:00 — Kati says corrections must create a noticeable impact so the dog understands the behavior…

It doesn't matter what time it is. It doesn't matter who's home. It doesn't matter if they're excited or not. It doesn't matter if it's a girl or a boy. I can't jump on them because the result is always the same and it's always awful, right? So some dogs, it's, it might be like one correction done, they never jump again.

Other dogs, they might need a little more help going, oh, well I'm gonna try jumping on this person 'cause they're tall. I'm gonna try jumping on that person. 'cause they have hat, like they might need more. Oh, I guess it's everybody. But I will say probably, you know, 90% of dogs, if you're doing this properly, you're only gonna do it a few times. Now if you're a weenie about it, <laugh>, and I don't mean to, I don't mean to make fun of people that are a little bit unsure because a lot of people are, especially at first.

Um, but you need to hear this because if you're weenie about it, then again you're just gonna kind of get your dog used to it and it's gonna be meaningless and you're just torturing yourself, pushing the button over and over again. You're not getting anything done, you're not getting any traction and your dog's still gonna jump.

And then when I see you on the street, you have to look me in the eye and tell me something stupid like we're working on it <laugh>. So that's not a behavior you work on. That is a behavior you stop. Okay? So jumping is stopped in a day, stopped in a few seconds, really. But again, your dog might need to see it a few times. Um, if you do it right, goes away, right? So simple behaviors, like that's how we punish them. That's it. There's no magic there. There's no big long training process. You just make the behavior uncomfortable by tying it to something really uncomfortable.

And that's it. And the beauty is, once you've done that, which should be really quick, then you move on to the other side of that where everybody wants to be. And now someone comes through the door, your dog stays on the floor, and you can actually look at your dog and say, good, right?

And maybe you're careful at first not to get them all sorts of riled up. Um, but now you can actually tell them they're good and then you just need to rehearse that, right? So just as important as the correction is the repetition of doing the right thing. So we can start to cement that and make it normal, right? Because for all these months or years your dog's been jumping on people. So then you knock it out and now you wanna do repetition, repetition, repetition, where they're not jumping on people because they're choosing not to jump on people.

And so if you can put them in that situation frequently where they're making that choice over and over and over again, it starts to become an easy choice to make.

And now you're cooking with gas <laugh>. Okay? So most behaviors, that's how it works. Now, there are some things that are more challenging. A lot of times reactivity can be more challenging. Things that are really, a dog is really intense and drivey about and it's really genetically ingrained in their makeup. Um, can be harder, it can be impossible, but that's rare, right? But for instance, I've seen a lot of hunting dogs that are just born with this absolutely incredible intense drive to hunt and kill prey. And with a lot of those dogs, you're never gonna punish that behavior.

24:00 — Kati distinguishes intense prey drive from behaviors that can reliably be suppressed through correction.

You're never, you're never gonna be able to suppress that behavior. Now a dog can have a pretty intense drive and you can punish and inhibit the behavior, right? I'm just saying that there are dogs out there with certain behaviors, they just don't have the ability to inhibit it. They just don't. It's like asking someone not to blink or for, or, you know, not to have a heartbeat.

It's just, it's just not gonna happen. Um, but that is super, super rare. You almost never see that in like family pet dogs, right? 99.9% of the time you've got a behavior you don't like, you can knock it out. Uh, reactivity with some dogs can be a little more difficult. Um, they, you know, dogs can be really intense about it. You're gonna run into a lot of different scenarios, uh, with different levels of challenge. You know, threading the needle, like walking right by another dog, really super close, um, can be really hard even once you get your dog doing well.

Um, but the principles don't change.

It's really the same. And I think when we're talking about reactivity specifically, the thing that people are missing is the timing because they wait until the dog is already going off the deep end and you've just totally missed the boat if you do that. So if you remember back when we were talking about the jumping, I said, as the behavior is about to occur, like as your dog is bee lining over there to jump, when you're dealing with reactivity, that's when you have to catch it, right? So I don't wanna go off on a tangent about reactivity specifically.

I just wanted to add a footnote here that it can be more difficult and it can be more nuanced than just dealing with a simple behavior like jumping or barking out the window or getting into the trash.

Um, sometimes that requires a little bit more of a skillset, but not always. A lot of dogs just give it right up, right? But I'll tell you right now before we move on. Like, if you have a reactive dog, you want them to know what no means before you go on that walk. They should know that no predicts a very high correction. So you want to pair that no to a correction beforehand. And then the moment your dog sees another dog and lights up, lights up, meaning the ears go up, tail goes up, the eyes start to get big.

That's your moment. So people say, oh, the dog's not doing anything. Yes, they are, they're starting the process of going off a cliff and that's when it's happening. But everybody misses that and they allow it to escalate, escalate, escalate. And then it's too late.

So if you try to correct your dog when they're already too far gone into that escalation process, into that reactivity, um, it's probably not gonna work. It's probably gonna be pretty awful. You're probably gonna drive them up. Um, sometimes it works. Not saying you can't do it, I'm just saying you, you've already kind of missed boat, you've missed your moment. It's kind of like better luck next time at that point. And so really with any behavior, the the most optimal time to market with a no is the moment the process begins, which is gonna be before the behavior that's optimal.

28:00 — Kati identifies the moment a dog notices another dog and begins focusing as the…

Um, but so if you don't have an eco, well get one <laugh>. Um, but really the other things you can do, um, besides an e-collar is you could have a prong collar on your dog in a leash and have them just drag the leash around. Granted, you need to be supervising them whenever you do that in case it should get caught on anything. Um, and after you say no, you can just calmly walk over to the dog, pick up the leash and deliver a nice firm snappy leash pop. Uh, if you don't know how to do that, that is a skill you need to practice it, right?

I find that's why I find the eco is so much more effective and efficient. Like you just, it's so easy, right? And it's less invasive. Like people struggle to deliver the correction physically themselves with the knee color. You just have to push the button. Um, but a, a leash pop needs to be poppy. It needs to be snappy. It's not just a tug. Um, it's not a pull. It's, it's really a very snappy firm pop. Um, it should really kind of startle the dog and maybe be uncomfortable for like a split second. Um, but it's more of like a holy crap <laugh>.

Um, but that's an option. And then a bonker is an option. A bonkers, a fabulous tool. Um, especially for arousal related behaviors like jumping and like barking. Sometimes it's even more effective than the e-collar because it actually operates on a totally different mechanism. So ecos like if you're gonna deliver a high e-collar correction for a bad behavior, obviously the reason they work is because they're physically uncomfortable, right? We are causing pain, we're not causing any harm. But it hurts. And that's why it's like, oh my God, I'm not gonna jump anymore. That hurts. I'm stupid.

I'm gonna stop doing that. Um, if you're using a bonker, that's not the case. So when your dog's excited, they actually don't feel physical discomfort the way they normally do because all the receptors in the brain become dulled. Everything becomes more mild, okay? And so some dogs you could actually, like we were just talking about the extreme hunting dogs, right? Like in that case, if you put an e-collar on one of them and you put it on a hundred when they saw prey and you held that button down, they wouldn't blink. <laugh>

Tell you right now, they wouldn't blink. Um, and so when you have a dog that's really aroused, they might not be that bad. Um, but they're not, they're not gonna feel this or respond to this the same way they would when they were calm. They're not gonna notice it or care about it the same way. Now if you're using a bonker, you're not relying on any kind of physical sensation really. You're relying more on the visual, you're relying more on fear. And guess what? That doesn't become dampened in the brain when the dog is aroused.

And so that's why it can be very, very effective with these arousal related behaviors. And so if you're going to bunk your dog, what you need to do is just take a bath towel, fold it in half, and roll it up nice and tight and put two rubber bands, um, on each end. Now when I say fold it in half, I mean lengthwise. So it's nice and long and thin. Roll it up nice and tight. Put rubber bands on it to hold it together. And that's it. That's your bonker.

No pipes in there, guys, no nothing. Hard <laugh>, no, um, no stones, no bricks, right? Just, uh, just a cotton or poly, whatever it, whatever towels are made of. That's, that's all it should be. Just fabric. Okay? Nothing hard. And, um, after you say no, you will chuck that bonker, excuse me, I feel another one coming. You will chuck that bonker right at your dog's head, not at their butt. And not gently guys. It's just a towel. You gotta, you gotta do it firmly. 'cause again, like you're gonna desensitize your dog to it. And I've seen this a thousand times because again, people are weenies, right?

32:00 — For a bonker, she recommends using only a soft fabric towel and avoiding hard…

And so they grab their little towel and they ugh, and they just tap the dog with it and the dog thinks it's a great freaking game and they grab it and they're playing tug with it and everything else. Uh, they're, they're not doing it correctly. So it has to be firm and it has to be at the head. Okay? Now you can throw it. So, which means you can get your dog at a distance if you have good ham or you can hold onto it and just go pop your dog on the head with the towel.

No, you're not gonna hurt your dog. Okay? Now use a little bit of common sense. If you have a tiny dog or you're like some kind of bodybuilder <laugh>, okay? We're not trying to harm the dog, but it does have to be just a nice firm thunk, right? And it's actually gonna vary a lot from dog to dog. So some dogs are super, super soft and sensitive. Some dogs are really, really confident, independent and bullheaded and resilient. Um, and so, you know, it's gonna be really important with those guys that you don't, you're not a weenie when you do this.

It just won't work.

Nine outta 10 of my customers tell me, oh, my dog just thinks it's a game and it's because they're doing it wrong. And I understand it's like counterintuitive and you feel like you're hitting your dog. Um, but you have to remember, we're not hurting them. This is not gonna harm them in any way, shape or form. You're not taking out your anger on them. You're simply trying to modify a behavior. And so you need to get that attached to the behavior so that it goes away. That's it. And that's kind of the beauty of it too, is there doesn't need to be any anger or frustration or yelling if you do this.

It's when you don't do this stuff that you end up screaming and yelling at your dog all the time. And I'm sorry, but that's no way to live. Like that's no relationship. I don't wanna be frustrated with my dog and yelling my head off all the time. Like you literally just say no and go deliver the consequence and that's it. And it should be unemotional really most of the time. Pretty neutral, right? But the dog just doesn't like the consequence and the behavior goes away and everybody's happy and you can go about your life. But, so those are some examples of the ways that we inhibit behaviors.

35:00 — She identifies e-collar corrections, bonkers, and leash corrections as her three primary methods for…

And those are the three big ones that we use. Eco bonker leash pop on a prong collar.

Now there are spray bottles, there are noise makers. Um, those things are fine. Uh, I don't use them. I feel like a lot of times, um, you're really just building the dog's confidence with them. Like it's barely enough to stop the behavior and then it doesn't really stop it. They kind of try it again and then they kind of just get used to, to hearing it or feeling the spray bottle and it's just not a big deal anymore. And I mean, how many dogs do you know that play in the garden hose? Like it's just not a punishment for most dogs.

And remember, the goal isn't to stop the behavior in the moment. It's to eliminate the behavior long term.

So you don't wanna have to use something that is just an interruption, right? It's just gonna turn into nagging, right? It's like jumping. A lot of people will say off, off and they want their dog to get down when they say off. And it's like, why? That's not a punishment. And so it's great. It's like, okay, I understand like you can teach your dog what off means and that's fine. And when your dog jumps on somebody, you can say off and they get down. Okay, fine, great, I get that. I understand that. But how does that stop jumping?

It fucking doesn't. It doesn't stop jumping guys. Your dog is gonna jump again in two frigging seconds and you're gonna have to say off. And then the next person comes in and they're gonna jump on them and you're gonna have to say off. And I mean, if that's how you wanna live, great <laugh>, go ahead. Right? But it's stupid like, 'cause you shouldn't need a command to ask your dog to stop doing something that they're not allowed to do, right? And that's your fault, not the dogs because that's what you're teaching them. So instead say no, attach a consequence, like a real consequence to the behavior and don't allow it anymore.

And then you can both just be happier. 'cause you know exactly, your dog knows exactly what's expected and you know exactly how to get what's expected. And then that's it. We can all move forward. <laugh>.

It's the same reason I don't teach. Leave it, right? Because we're asking dogs to leave things that they should never be paying attention to in the first. You shouldn't be barking at other dogs. You shouldn't be picking up trash off the street. I'm not gonna ask you not to do that every single time we walk by a dog or a piece of trash. Uh, but I mean this is the, this is the advice people are being given. So I don't blame them like they're using the information that they could find. It's just bad information, right?

38:00 — She argues that attaching a real consequence to “no” is more effective than requiring…

And I'm sure it makes people crazy, right? 'cause they're going through their whole life now and it's off, off, off. Leave it, leave it, leave it management, management, management, management. And your head's spinning.

And you can never stop like micromanaging your dog for two seconds. You can never like, just enjoy your walk, enjoy your conversation with somebody did it at a coffee shop. You can't do any of that stuff because you have to give constant instruction to the dog constantly begging the dog not to do these things that they're not supposed to be doing. So instead just tell them not to do it in a way that actually works and sticks. So they will stop doing it, not just today, but they won't do it tomorrow or the next day or the next day.

I just wanna reiterate one more time that if you're dealing with something like reactivity, um, that can be harder. It's not always, but it can be. Timing is super important. Um, if you're dealing with prey drive, I'm not gonna say that's really necessarily harder, although it can be like I just described with the hunting dogs, like it certainly can be. Um, but it usually requires a much, much higher level of correction than people realize. Because if your dog's prey drive is that intense, the correction is going to need to overpower that. I'm gonna give you an example.

I have a dog here for Borden train right now. It's a German shepherd mix and she tried to attack my cat yesterday. So she has a, a pretty good prey drive on her. And she saw my cat, she stared for a second. I could see it coming. Uh, I went to mark that with a no. And the second I made a motion, she went for it.

Uh, she didn't get the cat cat's fine, she was on a leash. Um, I said no, I put my e-collar on a 100, which is as high as it goes. And I held the button down for about eight seconds. Now it's not pretty when you do that, okay? But when you get the opportunity to inhibit a behavior like this, which is a very dangerous behavior and could have a really awful result, you cannot afford to leave anything on the table. You cannot afford to miss that window, miss that opportunity to make an impact and make it stick, right?

So I'm not gonna spend two weeks with a dog in my house that might kill my cat when I'm not looking.

Now granted, dogs don't spend a lot of time in my house like unsupervised. It's very structured, but things happen, right? Management fails, guys. It always does at some point or other. So if you're gonna be in my house, you're gonna learn to respect the fucking cat <laugh>. Okay? So e caller on a hundred held the button down for about seven or eight seconds. She screamed the whole time. Um, it's awful. I don't like it. But what am I thinking? What am I thinking during that seven or eight seconds? That's what I'm thinking. I'm thinking I have to do this.

I cannot miss this opportunity that's been given to me. I need to make this stick.

I cannot afford to come in too soft, too slow, too weak, and then go, oh well better luck next time she tries to kill the cat. We're gonna do it. We're gonna do it right and we're gonna do it right now. Okay? So five minutes later we're just kind of sitting in the living room after that, taking a breather and uh, five minutes later the cat comes walking by <laugh> because you know, cats <laugh> and uh, the dog, I think she might have actually broken my <laugh>, my table lamp, not my table lamp, my floor lamp.

42:00 — She rejects weak corrections in dangerous situations and insists the first correction must be…

Um, trying to scramble up into my lap on the couch to get away from the cat. And so if you are the type of person that's listening to this and you're going, well, isn't that too much? Do we want the dog to be afraid of the cat? Yes, we want the dog to be afraid of the cat, Jesus Christ, better than a dead cat.

Um, and it's probably not forever, right? So yeah, she was terrified out of her head when she saw the cat, uh, because it was very fresh <laugh>, okay? It just happened a minute ago. Um, but she's gonna see the cat a lot, okay? The cat still lives there. The cat is around the cat's in line of sight all the time and she's going to get to experience that. Just seeing the cat does not cause a correction. Being near the cat does not cause a correction, okay? But it takes a little bit of time for her to see that.

What causes the awful correction is looking at my cat like you see dinner, that's what causes that kind of correction. Uh, and as soon as she has that pattern established, we're gonna be great. Okay? And the next day, uh, when we walked by the cat, she was very respectful, um, still didn't wanna stare at the cat, which is good 'cause I won't allow staring at the cat anyway. Um, but she sees the cat, she looks away, her ears go back. She goes, oh crap, right? She didn't freak out like she did the day before, but she knew, well, I need to be careful.

I see the cat, I can't look at the cat with those eyes. I need to stay on the straight and narrow. And that's what we want.

Okay? So that's how you do it guys. That's how it is done. But even, even with what I did and what I saw as a result, I am not stupid enough to think we're done. So now I'm gonna be watching for the first time she looks at the cat and those ears come forward again and the eyes get kind of big again and she gets stuck looking at the cat, right? So when you see the cat, just look away like you don't need to stare at the cat. If you're staring at why are you staring at the cat, especially if those ears come forward or the eyes get big and there's lots of other stuff I look forward to, right?

Tail tension, um, breathing, hackles, any, any of that. So you're just not allowed to look at my cat like that. And so I'm gonna be on the lookout for that.

So the first time it happens, I can correct that and I don't have to correct that as intensely as I did the initial, uh, the initial behavior. But it is gonna be high 'cause we're going to make sure this sticks that she understands exactly what the thing is that's not allowed, right? So if you come in too soft, too slow, too weak, too low, that has quite a rhyme to it right there, that's pretty good. But if you do that okay, too low, too slow, you might interrupt the behavior in the moment. You might even dissuade your dog from doing it like when you're around.

But they're gonna push that boundary the second they get a chance, okay? On a day where they're just feeling their oats or on a day where they think you're not paying attention or you're not around and then you've get a dead cat, of course you wouldn't trust your dog. Hopefully you wouldn't trust your dog around your cat until you knew things were good. But my point is, even when you do things right, you can't assume you're just done. You wanna be watching. And that's so important because the next time your dog does try to give it a little bit of a whirl, that's really a fork in the road for the behavior a lot of the time.

Meaning what happens that next time determines Is this behavior gonna be shut off like potentially forever or is it gonna start to increase again?

So a lot of times what we see happen is someone will successfully inhibit a behavior and then the dog decides at some point down the road to just give it another shot. And if they miss that, well now the behavior just starts to pick up again, right? Because the dog sees, oh, maybe it's cool now. However, on the flip side of that, if they catch it the next time the dog gives it a shot, the dog now goes, Nope. I guess that's it. That's all there is to it. Can't do this. And it gets the brain like puts it to bed, right?

48:00 — She says a dog’s next attempt after correction can determine whether the behavior is…

So we're, we're on the lookout to see, um, catch that moment if it occurs, um, where she looks at the cat with, um, <laugh> too much, too much excitement in those eyes. Um, but that's it. What else? What else? Any anything else I can think of, uh, that's worth sharing? When it comes to inhibiting behaviors? I don't really think so. I think you can get creative too. Like the important thing is you're not doing anything that can harm your dog. None of the tools I mentioned are gonna harm your dog.

An eco isn't gonna harm your dog. Um, especially the ones we use, which are all from eco technologies. Don't use anything else. Um, they don't burn your dog. They can't give them a heart attack's gonna happen. Uh, a prong collar isn't gonna harm your dog, especially the herm springers. That's what we usually use. Um, they're not even sharp. They're very blunt. People think prong collar are sharp. No they're not. Um, a bonker certainly isn't gonna harm your dog. You know, it's cotton towel, uh, right on top of the head. Some people do the snout. I wouldn't do that.

Uh, not because it's like bad, but um, their eyes are right there. So, you know, I would wanna be careful probably not to like switch an eyeball or something, but you're not gonna hurt your dog guys. Um, that's all that matters, right? So you find you need to find a way to tie that intolerable consequence to whatever behavior it is you want to eliminate.

And if you're dealing with something that's a little more intense, a little more complicated or nuanced, then get some help. Um, but you know, and a lot of these things too, it's like once your dog just knows you're a person that has real expectations, real rules and real boundaries, man, they just snap into shape a lot of times and a lot of the stuff just melts away, you know, which is why a lot of times we don't see the behaviors that the owners see or we don't see them to the same degree. Um, because things are so different with us.

They're so structured and we have expectations and we always follow through. Uh, and we provide consequences for things. And we provide more than just, you know, food rewards all the time. We're not just shoving food down the dog's throat all the time and never correcting them for anything which is wildly unbalanced.

Um, and so they come here and they see that and they don't, they just don't do a lot of the stuff that they do with their, with their owners. Um, so yeah, but you find your own, your own correction that works for you, that's easy for you to do that your dog hates, but that it doesn't cause harm. Um, but the timing of your marker is crucial. So I just wanna reiterate that one last time. Your dog goes to jump, um, starts to bark your dog, you know, starts staring at something that you know they're gonna react to your dog.

Um, what else?

The moment they go to run through the open door, the moment, you know, whatever it is, the moment that process begins, you have to say no. And you don't want to even begin to deliver a consequence until after you say no. So you get learn to breathe and slow it down. Worry about the timing of your no above and beyond all else. 'cause once you do that, once you've said no at the right time, now you've got some time. So you can take your time and think about, okay, now what do I do? And you don't have to rush through it.

So a lot of people don't know that. They think it has to be now, now, now, now, now. And it doesn't, right? So there are other nuances to this stuff. Um, but that's far and away most of the process. Like those are the big pieces and they apply like 99% of the time.

And as simple as it is, everybody screws it up. 'cause humans make up their own rules, they make their own exceptions. It's always, well, but, well, but well but this, and no, the rules don't change. They really don't. You gotta stick to the rules, right? So if your dog jumps on somebody and you say no, and then they go and lay down and you don't correct them because they went and laid down, you are not following the process. Sorry to tell you. But nowhere in this episode did I say don't deliver the correction if your dog stops doing the behavior.

I never said that. People just make this stuff out, right? And I mentioned that one. 'cause that's a common one. People will say, oh, but now she's not doing it. I don't care. When did I say that mattered? It doesn't matter, right? So if you do not deliver that correction, you have now provided your dog with a free pass with a loophole, they have found a loophole, a way that they can still do this stupid behavior that you hate and get away with it.

All they have to do is stop when you tell 'em to. It's no different than saying off if you do that, right? If you're content with that, then you might as well just go back to saying off <laugh>, the rules are very simple. Mark it with a no. Follow that with an intolerable consequence. Do not make exceptions. Do not try to change the rule and you will have tremendous success can just about guarantee it. But if you don't, then it means something's lacking, right? And again, genetics always play a role. Um, so every dog is different and has different limitations, but again, like 99% of the time behaviors can be inhibited just fine if you know how to do it.

54:00 — Kati summarizes the process: mark with “no,” apply an intolerable consequence, and avoid exceptions.

And it's pretty unlikely that you have one of those dogs, um, that just can't change, right? But it's possible they're out there. Um, every dog's different. Well, that's it for today, guys. Um, hopefully you got some good info here and some had some good takeaways and hopefully you can take that and apply it and, um, see some improvement in your own life with your dog. And who knows, maybe it'll improve your relationship, right? So everyone's gonna tell you that if you do this stuff that I'm talking about, it's going to damage your relationship. The fact is, if you do it and you do it correctly and you get traction, you're gonna have such a better relationship with your dog because the frustration's gonna melt away.

The yelling can go away, the anger can go away. Um, and you can include your dog in more because they're gonna be better behaved. And that really is what it's all about is, is we wanna enjoy our dogs more <laugh>. Okay, that's it for today guys. Thank you for joining me and I look forward to next time.